George Kell interview
Date1989 May 20
DescriptionTwo audio cassettes featuring an interview with George Kell conducted by Rod Roberts on the behalf of the National Baseball Hall of Fame and Museum on May 20, 1989 in Detroit, Michigan.
Object numberHF-1994-0001-020
Interviewer
Roberts, Rod
Interviewee
Kell, George, 1922-2009
Subject
Kell, George, 1922-2009
Classificationsaudio/visual materials
Library Call NumberCTA 828
Library Call NumberCTA 829
Collection NumberBA RMA 001 Rod Roberts oral history collection
Dimensions2 audio cassettes
TrannscriptionCassette 1Side One -- Track 1 - Born in Swifton, AR, lived there every day of his life; forgot to ask his father which house he was born in, Aug. 23, 1922; Kell is a German name; is mother was a Perrin, an Irish name; he can trace ancestors back to Ireland; most of the Kell family came from Kentucky in the 1830s; his father came to Swifton in 1920, came from a town in northern Arkansas, his mother was from the same town, was a child bride, 16 when they married; they lived in Swifton until she died in 1975 and his father died in 1987; three boys in the family, he was the oldest, his brother Frank was two years younger, was a pilot in the Air Force and killed in the War; his brother Skeeter was seven years younger and played for the Philadelphia Athletics for a full year and a partial year; he owns a sporting goods store, and manager for Balfour ring company that makes World Series rings, sells to schools (00:00:00 to 00:02:57) Track 2 - On playing baseball as long as he can remember; his father was a successful amateur and semi-pro baseball player, also a barber; Swifton bought him a barber shop so he could pitch for the town team; used to play for hire at various places; when Kell was 10-12 years old, his father put him in to play second base; and his mother yelled at him; never played with his father; his brother Skeeter did play; his father played and managed until he was 50 years old so he could play with Skeeter; he played with his father as the manager (00:02:57 to 00:05:39) Track 3 - On playing high school baseball, three years of American Legion baseball in Newport, AR; used to hitchhike down to Newport play; played every Wednesday and Sunday; played one year of college baseball, only 17 years old, then came back to play American Legion ball; they had a professional team, in the Northeast Arkansas League; the Brooklyn Dodgers owned the Newport Club, they invited him to sign a contract in July, 1940; he played the rest of the year and all of 1941 there (00:05:39 to 00:07:17.5) Track 4 - In spring 1942, moved to Durham and was released; he was going to go home, but the Lancaster, PA club came to play and needed a second baseman, so he said he was a second baseman, he signed with them, hit .299 and moved to third base, in 1943 batted .396 for Lancaster, led all organized baseball in batting; Connie Mack bought his contract for the Philadelphia Athletics; there was a shortage of ball players because of the War; he had a good day when Mack came and scouted, and Kell had a good day, hit a couple of home runs; a lot of scouts were there; the Yankees scout Paul Krichell said the Yankees would sign him if Mack didn't; Mack picked up Kell, Lew Flick and (Charlie?) Major Bowles (00:07:17.5 to 00:10:24) Track 5 - He led the team in hitting in the American Legion ball, and in college; Brooklyn released him because they had a lot of players; he was one of about 20 players who got cut (00:10:24 to 00:11:59.5) Track 6 - On Connie Mack, he was 84 years old when Kell got to the Major League; Mack was very good to him; first year in spring training, in Hagerstown, MD, and his wife wanted to go with him, but they didn't have any money; and Mack sent her a plane ticket and didn't take anything out of his check for the fare; Mack didn't have a lot of money; Kell made $3,000 the first year, and $5,000 his second year, hit .272; Earle Mack, Connie's son, said his father was impressed and was going to give him a $1,000 bonus, but he didn't get it, so he asked for a meeting; Mack was always very accessible, and they gave him a check for $1,000, which was a lot of money at that time (00:11:59.5 to 00:15:54.5) Track 7 - Mack established a baseball scholarship at Duke University, one of his players, Jack Coombs, was a coach there, with the understanding that he would have first rights to any good players, only wound up with two players, Ace Parker and one other, but gave a lot of boys a good education; on no one having a bad work to say about Mack; past his prime and often had disagreements with owner Al Simmons and his son Earle; Mack always wore a dark suit; kept score all through the games; never used profanity, or raised his voice; he had players that were hard to handle, but they respected him; if Mack couldn't handle someone, he moved them on; didn't tolerate outbursts (0015:54.5 to 00:19:17.5) Track 8 - On Bob Johnson, in 1943 was traded to Washington for Bobby Estalella; but Johnson was a good ballplayer (00:19:17.5 to 00:19:49) Track 9 - On Dick Siebert at first base, Frankie Hayes at catcher; Estalella in the outfield, along with Elmer Valo, had been around a few years; Irv Hall at second base, and Ed Busch at shortstop; Hal Peck came from Milwaukee, a great hitter but lost two toes so never got it going; Hayes was considered an outstanding catcher, a good hitter, a stabilizing force with the young pitchers; many of his best pitchers had gone off to War, (Phil) Marchildon, Dick Fowler, Lou Brissie; they had a competitive ball club, but finished last (00:19:49 to 00:21:57.5) Track 10 - On Marchildon being in a prison camp, and he was never the same when he came back, never really strong again, and mentally, was never as tough as he once was; Fowler was in the Canadian army, and also was not the same when he returned (00:21:57.5 to 00:22:59) Track 11 - On Lum Harris, Russ Christopher, Jittery Joe Berry; Christopher was an underhand, submarine-style pitcher, one of the few who would speak his mind to Mack; one time in 1945, they played in Detroit, a 24-inning game, 1-1 tie, called on account of darkness; Bill Summers was umpire behind the plate; Christopher pitched 12 innings and just couldn't pitch anymore; he had a heart condition and died soon after leaving baseball (00:22:59 to 00:25:14) Track 12 - On Jesse Flores, a good pitcher, great curveball; saw him in California, working as a scout, he didn't recognize him but they had a great (00:25:14 to 00:25:55) Track 13 - On Bobo Newsom, traded for Roger Wolff, a great attraction for the crowd; Bobo was Mack's meal ticket because he would pack in the people; he used to kid around with Mack; Bobby Estalella and Newsom nearly got in a fight, and they said "horse-feathers to you" and Mack took him out of the game; on catcher Greek George, he was high strung and high-tempered and argued balls and strikes with Joe Rue at home plate and called him a no-good SOB, and Rue went after George, and George hit Rue with his fist; Cal Hubbard, umpire in chief got them separated, and threw George out of the game; Mack was very angry; George was sold to the Minor League Portland team (00:25:55 to 00:30:37.2) Track 14 - On Ford Garrison, outfielder, he and Kell roomed together and were good friends; a good ballplayer, could run well, played hard (00:30:37.2 to 00:31:38) Track 15 - On Sam Chapman, one of best ballplayers Mack ever had, came back from the service in 1946, and Kell was traded to Detroit, so they only played together about two months, but played against him the next 4-5 years (tape runs out) (00:31:38 to 00:32:14.5) Side Two -- Track 1 - (Comment picks up in the middle) Kell was supposed to present to Hank Greenberg, but Greenberg was too sick to travel, died shortly thereafter of cancer; he was a class act (00:00:00 to 00:01:00) Track 2 - On Dick Wakefield, could run like a deer; tall rangy guy, just like Ted Williams, hit .336 his first year, went into the service and didn't hit as well when he came back; he was a free spirit, drove managers up the wall, never married; could have been a lot better than he was, but put a lot into baseball; the first of the big bonus boys; Tigers gave him $55,000 and a new Buick to sign, right from the campus of University of Michigan, set every record in the big 10; played with him for about 5 years until Detroit sold him; all downhill from there (00:01:00 to 00:03:33) Track 3 - Hal Newhouser, one of the toughest pitchers ever seen; one tough competitor, should be in the Hall of Fame; he pitched against all of the big hitters, DiMaggio, Williams after the War; when he first came up he was wild and erratic; like most left-handers, he developed later in life, had great control, great curve ball; didn't always get along with him, but admired him as a great pitcher; in 1947, had Newhouser, (Virgil) Trucks, (Dizzy) Trout and (Fred) Hutchinson, four great pitchers, finished second in '46 and ‘47 to the Yankees; also in '46 had Tommy Bridges and Al Benton; had great pitching all the time Kell was in Detroit, also had Ted Gray, Art Houtteman; Billy Pierce, all born and raised near Tiger Stadium, Stubby Overmire also came out of Grand Rapids; had a great scout, Butch(?) Higgin(?;) the system doesn't work that way today; they used to have tryout camps and if you wanted to play baseball, they'd sign you to a Minor League club, so they had a good supply of players; today they don't sign a boy out of high school or college unless they are convinced he could make it in the Majors (00:03:33 to 00:08:29) Track 4 - On what makes a ballplayer; certain requirements: speed, power, a good throwing arm, size; see a big strong kid that can run like the wind, they'll sign him; today's system loses some ballplayer; if you could look into the heart and see "desire" that would tell you who would be a good ballplayer (00:08:29 to 00:10:05.5) Track 5 - On Jackie Jensen, played with him in Boston, led the league in RBIs and home runs one year; he's a football-playing baseball player, a competitive spirit and wanted to excel, he was an outstanding player at University of California Berkeley; signed with the Yankees originally, always disappointed he didn't make it big with the Yankees; had his best years in Boston; outstanding hitter, good outfielder; he had some problems, hated to fly, was gone from home too much, Kell roomed with him one year in Boston, he called his wife every night, she was 3,000 miles away and it was a tug-of-war on him every day he played ball; Kell took his family to spring training, rented a home in Detroit from Steve Gromek's home, he pitched for Cleveland, and they rented Gromek's home for seven years; Kell quit playing at 35, he was in Baltimore, hit .299 last year, and his wife wanted him to quit, two or three years sooner than he probably would have; same with people in the military (00:10:05.5 to 00:14:36) Track 6 - On greatest defensive play he ever saw, was not there when Willie Mays made the catch on Vic Wertz, but he saw it on TV, and even Wertz doesn't believe the catch; Kell saw Jimmy Piersall make some plays that were out of this world, in Boston, the right field fence is short and runs right along the foul line; Piersall hit that fence and fell down and they thought he was dead, but he came up with the ball; Kell made a play once that he doesn't believe, Lou Boudreau was managing the Boston club, and they were playing in Tiger Stadium; that night, he and Kell were going to go to the University of Michigan to speak; the Red Sox filled the bases and Boudreau hit a line drive right over third base, down the left field line, and Kell dived for the ball, caught it in the webbing of his glove, rolled over twice and came up with the ball; Curt Gowdy said it was one of the 10 greatest plays of all time; and certainly one of the best plays Kell ever made (00:14:36 to 00:17:14) Track 7 - On third base changing; gloves are bigger so they make more catches; Brooks Robinson gave him a glove after he retired, and it's a third bigger than Kell's glove was; Robinson was the greatest third baseman that ever lived; not enough third basemen dive after the ball today, they don't want to get their uniforms dirty or get hurt; ball players make too much money today; worry about career-ending plays; he was taught to catch everything; played with Hoot Evers for 10 years, and when Kell went into the Hall of Fame, Evers said of Kell, "you couldn't drive a ball by him at third base" (00:17:14 to 00:20:11) Track 8 - On toughest pitchers on Kell, Cleveland had five pitchers, (Bob) Lemon, (Bob) Feller, (Herb) Score, (Mike) Garcia, and (Early) Wynn; Feller was the toughest pitcher he ever faced, but Lemon gave him more trouble, he had a dipsy-doodle ball that got Kell out regularly; one time he hit one over the left field wall off Lemon; the year he led the league in hitting, came down to the last day of the season, Ted Williams was leading him by two points; Lemon was pitching, he got a single, a double and a walked; Feller came in and he struck Kell out in the 7th; in the 9th inning, the word came down that Kell had beat Williams if he didn't bat again; they put Dick Wakefield in to pinch hit and he lined a single; the next guy went up, and then Eddie Lake hit a two-hop ground ball to Ray Boone at shortstop, turned it into a double play, and Kell threw his bat up 30 feet in the air, because that meant he led the league in batting (00:20:11 to 00:23:21) Track 9 - On having no regrets, baseball been so good to him; always wanted to be a baseball player, played 14 ½ years in the Major League; became a broadcaster, 30 years in Detroit, everything his family has came from baseball (tape runs out) (00:23:21 to 00:24:07.5) Cassette 2 Side One -- Track 1 - On making more money in his lifetime than he ever thought; when he was in his prime, top salary was around $75,000; he made $45,000 all the money in the world; made a lot more in broadcasting, he has no regrets; he gets disturbed when he sees ballplayers making a million, or a million and a half and he's dogging it, not giving his best out there; doesn't begrudge modern players making money; he hears about million-dollar players going bankrupt; wouldn't play for nothing, but would have played for less money; can't play for nothing, have to make a living, but a very good way of making a living; being well-paid for doing what he loved to do; his only regret is that he was gone from his family an awful lot of the time (00:00:00 to 00:03:25) Track 2 - He does regret never playing in a World Series; Tigers got close three times, finishing second; would have loved to play in a World Series; he played nine all-star games and made it into the Hall of Fame, but never played in a World Series (00:03:25 to 00:05:25) Track 3 - Best ballplayer, he'd pick Mickey Mantle, he did everything extremely well, Joe DiMaggio close to that; Ted Williams the best hitter he ever saw in his life (00:05:25 to 00:06:48) Track 4 - On the Hall of Fame selection process; writers not voting for him because they never saw him play; nothing fair about voting for a hall of fame, there will be good people left out; no sour grapes, but some guys are bitter about the voting; the writers do not do it as fairly as the old-timers committee (tape becomes audible from here) (00:06:48 to 00:08:25) Track 5 - On being voted into the Hall of Fame by the old-timers committee, people he played with and against; owners, general managers, presidents that saw him play., Joe Cronin, Birdie Tebbetts, they saw him play and knew what was in his heart, knew he was a winner and deserved to be in the Hall of Fame; some writer had no way of knowing; Charlie Gehringer was on that committee and spoke up for Kell; Tebbetts said he belonged in the Hall of Fame (00:08:25 to 00:09:31) Track 6 - On others who deserve to be in the Hall of Fame, Nellie Fox, Jim Bunning (tape ends) (00:09:31 to 00:09:58.5)" Public Access NotePlease note that not all works are on view at all times - their availability is subject to change per the discretion of the Museum staff. 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