Waite Hoyt interview
Date1981 October 11-12
DescriptionFive audio cassettes featuring an interview with Waite Hoyt conducted by Rod Roberts on the behalf of the National Baseball Hall of Fame and Museum on October 12, 1981 in Cincinnati, Ohio.
Object numberHF-1994-0001-030
Interviewer
Roberts, Rod
Interviewee
Hoyt, Waite, 1899-1984
Subject
Hoyt, Waite, 1899-1984
Classificationsaudio/visual materials
Library Call NumberCTA 769
Library Call NumberCTA 770
Collection NumberBA RMA 001 Rod Roberts oral history collection
Library Call NumberCTA 768
Library Call NumberCTA 771
Library Call NumberCTA 772
Dimensions5 audio cassettes
TrannscriptionCassette 1 Side OneTrack 1 - On being born in Brooklyn, Sept. 9, 1899, divisible by nine but someone else pointed it out to him, bad at math, his math skills extended to 3-2; averaged three strike-outs a game and 1.5 bases on balls a game, testifies to pretty good control; believes far too much are made of strike-outs, not everyone can be a Bobby Feller, Dizzy Dean or Nolan Ryan; he and Herb Pennock and Hoyt tried to make the batters hit, the science of pitching, more exact than brilliant (00:00:00 to 00:03:31) Track 2 - On Stan Coveleski, had great control, good control of his spitball, a tough fellow to beat; but we beat Stanley more than he beat us (the Yankees) (00:00:31 to 00:04:32) Track 3 - Lived in Brooklyn, signed with the Giants when he was 15, his father (Addison signed him to the Giants; when you were 15-16, you were considered a boy, a callow youth; back then, a fellow named Bobby Carter, now a dentist in Michigan, he used to be the Brooklyn mascot, and persuaded Jack Coombs, the pitcher, to let Hoyt come to Ebbets Field and pitch for batting practice; Casey Stengel was there and said the first time he got a look at Hoyt, he showed up in a uniform his mother made for him, kid could throw the hell out of the ball; George Cutshaw and Nap Rucker said he could get the ball over the plate; the Giants came to play and his father's friend catcher Red Dooin; Dooin told Giants manager (John) McGraw, who asked Hoyt to come and pitch batting practice for the Giants at the Polo Grounds, made the two-hour trip for a month and a half; in 1915, had Art Fletcher, in 1916 Benny Kauff came over; Hoyt told McGraw it was taking too long; called in John B. Foster, secretary of the Giants and they asked Hoyt's father to come to their offices to prepare an optional contract; his father very proud, swelled up like a poison toad; one of the peak days of his career, brought in the contract, and he signed and ascended to Cloud 9; and Foster gave him $5 to make the contract legal; his father took the money and bought a hat; suddenly became a national figure in the media, the youngest player to sign a major league contract, "the boy hero," along with billiards player Willie Hoppe; Joe Nuxhall of Cincinnati signed when he was 15, during the War, and was the youngest to pitch in a big league game (00:04:32 to 00:13:09) Track 4 - On Betty (Deery?), former secretary to Warren Childs; father worked for Mason Hanson, then went to L. Heller & Son, first company to introduce synthetic pearls, father sang and performed to supplement his income, played club dates with Barbara Stanwyck and others; he was also a Mason; every year, a grand play, and his father was the coach and producer for the play, for $5,000; developed a mania for the theater, organized Add Hoyt's Minstrels on the Keith-Albee-Orpheum circuit; there was a strike, the "White Rats" wanted more money and better conditions; Albee formed National Vaudeville Association and built a building; all the White Rats were blacklisted, so his father went with Hoyt's uncle, Marshall McDonald, to work for Swift & Co. meat packers; died of a heart attack in Detroit (00:13:09 to 00:20:02) Track 5 - Father really wanted him to be a ballplayer; father played semi-pro baseball at a field in Brooklyn, Hawthorne Field, he played third base (00:20:02 to 00:20:42) Track 6 - Hoyt is English/Dutch; family crest has no insignia on the top of the crest, a distant relative was accused in a plot of regicide of the English king; Hoyt's eventually settled in Manchester, Vermont; Hoyt homestead dates to 1764; mother's name was Lucia/Louise J. Benedum, was of German stock from Alsace-Lorraine, didn't know his grandfather; grandmother spoke with a German accent; his grandmother used to wear a red flannel under-skirt with a big pocket, sitting on a chair in the window, and she used to give him a dollar; one day he played a baseball game in high school and he lost, and his grandmother couldn't believe that he lost (00:20:42 to 00:26:42) Track 7 - First played baseball with his father, 4-5 years old, streets weren't paved, they were rutted and rough, and he and his father played toss and he had to field the ball in the ruts and the ball would bounce and his father told him to keep his head down; never saw a big league game until he was 12, saw Ebbets Field built brick-by-brick, used to be a big hole in the ground, squatters lived there; very conscious of the Dodgers, Jack Coombs rented his parents' house for the (00:26:42 to 00:29:09) Track 8 - First started playing for a Brooklyn team, the Wyandotts; also played for Erasmus Hall High School, played in the newspaper leagues, won all three leagues; he was a second baseman, became a pitcher because the team was going to have uniforms; played on the Brooklyn Parade Grounds, beautiful fields, his "salad days" in baseball, became a passion for him; pitched a fastball and a curveball; coach in high school named Bill Sykes, and he threw a palm ball and taught Hoyt how to throw it; Earl Smith catching for the Giants threw his bat at the palm ball without hitting it, and he credits Sykes; it amused him to hear Ted Williams, and Joe DiMaggio say that the pitchers before them, Hoyt, Joe Bush, Sam Jones, Herb Pennock only had fastball and curves; in 1923, had Jones, Bob Shawkey, Pennock, Carl Mays and Bush, and him the six-star pitchers, all had a bunch of different pitches, the only thing they didn't throw was a slider, George Uhle invented the slider, and threw it to Babe Ruth, Ruth didn't know how to hit it (00:29:09 to 00:34:01) Track 9 - Doesn't know the knuckle curveball, pitch like a computer, works sometimes and sometimes makes mistakes; Reds had one pitcher that threw it; Hoyt doesn't know how that thing is thrown (00:34:01 to 00:35:01) Track 10 - When he signed with the Giants, he weighed 165 and was 5'9"; kept growing and when he was with the Yankees, weighed 183 and 5'11¾" tall; Stanley Coveleski was inducted to the Hall of Fame same day as Hoyt in 1969, he lost so much weight and looked so thin; now, Hoyt is only 5'8" and only weighs 163; sometimes people talk about modern athletes being bigger and stronger, but they are looking at them in their old age (00:35:01 to 00:36:59) Track 11 - Turned pro at 15 and was getting paid at 16, so he wasn't allowed to play other sports, played a little soccer, he could punt very well and kick very well, lost the city championship to DeWitt Clinton; tennis was a socialite game so they didn't play that (00:36:59 to 00:38:44) Track 12 - On childhood; was far from teacher's pet, but was not a problem child, school was an enigma to him, went to Public School 92, got in a bit of trouble and was asked to leave; then went to P.S.90 until sixth grade, then to P.S.89 and graduated from there; school days, like his life, dotted with episodes that deviate from the norm; had to take a trolley car to school; kids in his class were passing a note, and he saw the note, and it reached him and he read the first line, and it was an off-color poem; he raised his hand and told the teacher, took it up to her desk, and took him to the principal's office, said he needed more difficult tasks and they promoted him to the graduating class; his living patterns always created a bit of excitement; he was asked to sing in the choral society, singing at graduation, and had to dance the minuet; his mother had to buy patent leather shoes, silk stockings and a velvet outfit; he sang soprano in one rehearsal and bass in the next (sings a snatch of song;) his partner in the minuet was an awful-looking turnip so he stepped on her toes to get kicked out of the minuet; then at graduation (tape runs out) 00:38:44 to 00:45:54) Cassette 1 Side Two Track 1 - More on grammar school graduation; a master of ceremonies would say something about each student; they got to Hoyt, and all they had to say was that he played second base on the baseball team; education nothing to brag about, left high school in his junior year to play baseball and never finished high school; he was 16 when he signed with the Giants, in 1916-17, U.S. entered World War I, and there was a huge influenza epidemic, killing more soldiers in training camps than in France; a friend of his, Ed Moran, played first base on Erasmus high school team was going to Middlebury College and his friend told him to come to college to avoid being drafted, he lived in a boarding house in Vermont; the dean of students wanted to see his Regents card, but he didn't have it, so they said they couldn't admit him without writing to Albany, so he did and got his card with 10 credits, couldn't get in without 12 credits; he played like he lost it to the dean and they admitted him without the card; first math course in college, he knew nothing at all; his two worst subjects were Latin and math; they would call on him and he never knew the answer; the professor made an address to the class, calling him a very poor example of a college student, a poor example of manhood, lazy, wastrel, not fit to attend school, predicted he will be a wastrel all his life and asked him what he intended to be, and Hoyt said "a mathematical teacher;" war ended on Nov. 11, so he didn't go back to college after Christmas (00:00:00 to 00:10:47) Track 2 - On John McGraw, one of the kindliest martinets you could possibly know, a rough-and tumble roisterer, a brilliant baseball man; very tough individual, one of kindliest, considerate fellows you could meet, very sarcastic, very profane, very rough; the Giants' club houses were behind center field, and if they were losing, he'd pick up two handfuls of black dirt and run alongside the umpires and call them names and throw dirt in their faces; when Hoyt joined the club, he had a high voice, and there was a lavatory with a wire mesh screen, and Bill Klem was the home plate umpire, nicknamed Catfish, and McGraw told Hoyt to yell at him from behind the screen, and told him to question Klem about taking his wife to a bordello in Paris by mistake; Klem blamed McGraw but it was Hoyt; they got Bill Rariden and McGraw used to give signals to the catcher, and Rariden had a bad day, came in the sixth or seventh inning, McGraw said "if we had anybody who could catch we'd win the pennant;" McGraw had a vitriolic tongue, a very powerful man in baseball; someone hit a home run off of Giants pitcher Fred Toney into the short right field grandstand, and McGraw sent Toney to the Braves, and the first time he pitched, someone hit an inside-the-park home run; money was tight in the old days, and when ballplayers retired, McGraw would make sure they had some work around the ballpark, see that they were taken care of; Mrs. McGraw thought the world of Hoyt; Hoyt spent three years in the Minor Leagues, 20 years in the big leagues and 25 years of baseball broadcasting, so connected with the game for 60 years (00:10:47 to 00:20:30) Track 3 - In 1916, he started in Lebanon, PA, pitched about a month, including a 19-inning game, beat 2-1 in front of six spectators, shifted franchise to Mount Carmel, bad ball field filled with rocks, they said wait until Shamokin team gets there, no more rocks left; they described a time when Stanley Coveleski's brother, Harry Coveleski was pitching for Shamokin, tried for a home run and never made it because someone hit him in the jaw with a rock; never got paid for that month in PA; sent to Hartford for two weeks; club owned by (James?) Clarkin; but Hoyt was broke and Clarkin refused to pay him without a contract; McGraw called him back to NY and sent him to another team in Lynn, MA; Hartford protested and the national commissioner Garry Herrmann awarded him back to the Giants; he was successful in Lynn, went back to the Giants in 1916 after Labor Day; Giants won 26 straight; McGraw was highly superstitious, and had a leather pouch where they kept the baseballs and he would give the bag into the clubhouse; one day playing the Cubs at bat and he stopped to watch and the Cubs scored a bunch of runs, so McGraw gave him hell (00:20:30 to 00:26:50) Track 4 - On Charles "Victory" Faust, "that nut," as bad as the guy who got married on Jack Parr's show, Tiny Tim; McGraw took him on the road with them because he was superstitious (00:26:50 to 00:28:28) Track 5 - On ballplayers giving him a hard time because he was a young kid; he pitched batting practice, Art Fletcher wanted high balls, Benny Kauff wanted the low ball, tried to hit the pitcher with a line drive; Larry Doyle the second baseman was very nice to him, died of tuberculosis, hit .315 one year, McGraw gave him instructions and he didn't do whatever it was, so Doyle came back to the bench and McGraw said mocked him as "Captain Larry Doyle, Laughing Larry," but Doyle was very kind to Hoyt (00:28:28 to 00:31:35) Track 6 - On Benny Kauff, a misguided guy, bought a dozen suits at a clip, an ostentatious dresser, a braggart, said he would out-do Ty Cobb but never did; came to a bad end, maybe arrested; he wasn't liked by the other ballplayers; Kauff came over as a center fielder, and they traded Edd Roush back to Cincinnati, they worked together one year, but Roush credited Kauff as being a good hitter; no hitter that you would say would lead the league, Hoyt reads off Kauff's record and lifetime batting average of .311 (00:31:35 to 00:35:36) Track 7 - On Harry Hooper, one of finest outfielders, invented the sliding catch, fine gentleman, in the Hall of Fame; quite an outfielder with (Tris) Speaker (00:35:36 to 00:36:33) Track 8 - On ballplayers being hoodlums; there were some rough characters, but also some college men, but there was an abundance of country boys, went to the little red schoolhouse, came from farms and ranches and country towns, did not have complete educations, and they were looked upon as ignoramuses, came to the big leagues and they weren't socialized, knew nothing about tipping or the proper fork, so they were looked down upon by the sophisticated media; Hoyt was a city boy and if you took us down on a ranch, wouldn't know how to make a living in their territory; a fellow wrote a book one time, talking about rednecks; had some roughnecks and some bad behaviors, especially in the Minor Leagues, those were the most exciting days in Hoyt's career; one time in the Southern League, the players weren't paid enough to be good tippers and the media used to call them "cheap," the waiters gave them the worst steaks (00:36:33 to 00:42:07) Track 9 - On Braggo Roth, played center field, could rotate his stomach muscles like a belly dancer, and he was a tough-talking guy, knew all the gangsters in Chicago, and never called anything by its right name, called his bat "Hector" and called himself "Doctor;" Bull Durham Co. used to have a photo of a bull on the outfield fence; if you hit the bull you got $50; Braggo hitting against Carl Mays, sinker pitcher; and Braggo "hit that bull in the ass and I made him evacuate" only he didn't use that word; very different from his brother Frank (tape runs out) (00:42:07 to 00:45:53) Public Access NotePlease note that not all works are on view at all times - their availability is subject to change per the discretion of the Museum staff. 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